Crafting Emmy Award Winners: Designer's Inside Story

James Connelly, an Emmy award-winning set designer, discusses his journey in set design, for some of the biggest shows including Tom Brady's Roast, The Voice, Vanderpump Rules, Top Chef, and Is It Cake.

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00:00 The Journey of a Set Designer

03:22 Challenges of Live Show Set Design

14:11 Transition to Virtual Production and AI Impact

25:34 Navigating Client Collaboration and Creative Process

32:48 Challenges and Rewards in the Entertainment Industry

43:22 The Power of Storytelling in Content Creation

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Where To Find James

https://www.instagram.com/jpconnelly/
https://jpconnelly.com/

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Where To Find Sean:

https://www.linkedin.com/in/sean-r-collins/
https://www.instagram.com/jukebooth/
https://www.jukebooth.com/

Transcript

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Like I've been, I've won an Emmy award three times. Yeah. And, thank you. And I've been nominated 18 times. That's not a good, that's not a good ratio there. I mean, to be nominated 18 times, that's pretty incredible. I haven't been nominated at all. Neither has Dan. So you're already winning in this circle. Today on the podcast, we have James Connolly. He's an Emmy award winning set designer. He's worked on things like Brady's Roast, The Voice for 25 years, Vanderpump, and he builds those beautiful sets that make the show experience that much better. We talked about everything, just storytelling and how he got to where he is and just some of the key factors in why he does what he does. And this is a great conversation that you'll enjoy. Yeah, I mean checking out your stuff is it's amazing like the design element is so cool and some of the biggest sets that have been developed in some of the most latest shows that people are watching right now I mean like the Brady roast was pretty massive This set was crazy for that. How long did that take? it's an interesting story So that took me so well actually I backtrack out once upon a time that show that project was something totally different and I had started with the executive producer on a Prod on a Version of it that wasn't going to be live and that was going to be much more intimate It wasn't going to be in a big arena setting it would it was going to be in a sort of more lounge speak easy type setting maybe audience of 250 compared to the forum, which is 17 ,000 and it would have been intimate super VIP VIPs and then a sort of raised area for sort of general public And we went back and forth on that design, I don't know, six or seven times. And for any reason that I don't know was just paused. And then it came back alive, sort of like December this year. And really didn't get finalized contractually, I think, above me. I don't know, lawyers and execs started working out their business until like March this year. It's not a long, not a lot of time. I mean, writers rooms for comedy start sometimes three months, six months in advance for a scripted project. Roasts are very comedy heavy. And so they hadn't even started any of that stuff. So we had, I guess, look back into my calendar as I speak about this, just to be more finite. We, so that was May 5th that aired. So I kind of got locked in my contract like the end of February, early March, there was this really weird pause of inactivity and delay between the executive creative team and myself all for a whole month. Like we would chat here and there. It wasn't very concrete. We would get close ish. We didn't go get on fire until about April one. And then we designed that show in like seven days. And then we revised that show for another three weeks after, which was grueling. And then we built it and we built it in the course of like two and a half weeks and we put it in and it was, it was tough. It was a tough project, but it was awesome. And it's boy, everybody's seen it. It's really rewarding. Yeah. I think that was the cool element of seeing the, the actual show too, is like the design of the whole space. Cause it's not just like, cool. It's in a theater. It's in this space. It was like all well -designed and that. part also like creates the experience, you know, it's not just like, here's a theater, this is cool, or doing a roast. Yeah, you know, it's really, really wild too, because up until we shot it, the head creative, executive producer was, and very vocal about like, This is a roast, it should not be live. This is going to be so scary. I was surprised they went live with it. I was scared when I watched some of it live. I'm like, what's gonna happen? That was the best part though. I know. That was the best part about it. Like it was, it felt unscripted and largely there were lots of parts that were unscripted and it was received live and it wasn't polished. I thought the idea was brilliant. It was. There was a lot of nerves and when you do live shows, you know, everybody, really works towards a certain polish. They wanna make sure it's perfect. They don't wanna fuck up. They don't wanna have the Oscar envelope moment where they say the wrong movie. And there were so many nerves. And when you deliver comedy from people who were not comedians, they were so scared that these football players were not gonna be funny. Yeah. They all delivered great. I kept saying, and now granted, I'm merely a set designer, production designer, whatever you wanna call me. I have no stake in that, right? But like I kept saying like that's this is going to be great. This is going to be epic. If they fuck up, like to me, like I love when Mariah Carey falls down. Like, I mean, like I love when you open the envelope and it's wrong. Like that's, that's like news. That's awesome. It's human. It's human and it's not AI and it's not cleaned up perfect. And I said, this is going to be awesome. Whatever. but there was so many nerves about it and then ultimately it was a huge success. I mean Kevin Hart was amazing. So good. Perfect. Yeah. Yeah, no, when I watched that, I mean, from beginning to end my cheeks were hurting. I almost had to turn it off because I'm like, I'm just laughing too hard. I mean, it was so inappropriate but so funny. They brought almost old comedy back, you know, where you could kind of say whatever you wanted. It was great. And for Kim Kardashian to go up and she's getting booed by half the crowd, And for her to ... She delivered amazingly. So much respect for her, even though I don't watch any of her shows, but she's such a ... I thought everybody did so well when they delivered their jokes and stuff. It was so good. Everyone was perfect. I mean, I feel like, except Ben Affleck, but everybody was perfect. I mean, Kim held the room, right? They booed her. I mean, that's so messed up, but that's also real. They booed her, and then she just ... She just slapped the munt crack down and it was like amazing. Yeah, that was unbelievable. It's a great delivery. Is this something, so like when you build the set for these shows, do you always get to be there if you want it to be to watch like the show or any of the live stuff or like some of the other stuff you've done as a cake one, like is it cake? So you get to be there if you want to like hang out for the whole show. That's cool. Totally open -ended. Do you usually stay for most of them? I don't usually stay. At least you're honest. I mean, you're like, I got shit to do. I got lawyers to fend off. I got shit to do over here. No, I'm not that mean in the legal world, but it is just like, you see an issue and you're just like, I'm a designer, right? I'm a problem solver. I see these issues and I'm just like, fuck, that's stupid. We're going to change that. But yeah, I don't stay. I used to stay, but now usually I, like for Brady, I could have stayed right there backstage and watched it, but then, I don't know, then you're standing for like three hours, guys. It's better. What I did is I left when they just started. I got home really fast and I watched it and I poured myself a glass of tequila and was like, fab, maybe three, maybe I had three tequilas. It was three hours long and I really enjoyed it. Yeah, even when you have a show, like, is it cake or something? They're not live. They don't move fast. Right. Your job is definitely done and you're kind of taking up airspace. There is a value of being on site. It's kind of exciting, but when you do, done it a lot. Sometimes you'd rather just go home to your family and just sort of it's equal to the story. I get that. And then when you're on a live set or your team is there, do they have to be like on alert because it's live and like if something were to fall apart or like something's like, Hey, we need to move this thing. Do you actually have a Have you ever done that where it's like, we need to move this thing or reset this piece? Sure. There are some down to the wire moments. There's no doubt about it. Yeah, I would say though, like my team doesn't really, they're on site, but you know, like you've prepared it enough and you, every show is rehearsed no matter what. Like everybody goes through rehearsal just to make sure that they look good in the lighting. I mean, look at you guys, right? You sit there, you make sure that the key lights up. Like everybody's practiced that. And generally there's really not too much that could happen. I would say like the live productions, they're probably the most at risk for something kind of crazy to happen. And you only have a limited amount of time to get it done. So, you know, for Brady, the big one was the throne was built too big. Everything came in perfect. Everything down to the carpet pre -cut was all perfect. Except for Tom's actual chair. It was so huge when it showed up, which is not something that you could be like, the camera will never see it. Like it was Tom's chair. So that was really wild. We had to send that back. It showed up late and we had to send it back immediately. And it didn't show back up until Sunday, Saturday, late night, Saturday night. And thank God it was done. And it trimmed down by six inches because he looked tiny in it. It was just goofy. So going back to like the beginning, how did you start this company? You know, what, what made you start and set design and stuff? I, I didn't really have like ever choose it. I think, it's just a good fit for me, but, I was in high school. I really liked the backstage kids. I did a lot of backstage theater. and then I went to college in Jersey cause I grew up in New Jersey and I went to Rutgers and I went to the theater program largely cause I liked what I was doing in high school and also. It was arts and so there were some classes you didn't have to take. And I was like, I could just do that. They're kind of cool and fun. And I studied set design and then those classes, the first few classes, I was like, I like set design. It seems like it's a good fit. You read a play, you make a diorama box about it. People like it, they don't like it. You change the diorama box and this is the job. And I thought, this is easy and it's fun and it's good. It's a lot of work, but. Yeah, the work is different. You do like craft projects and you don't study for final exams. And so it was like cool. And then when I graduated in 2002, the world was different because it was just post 9 11 and I was in New Jersey and moving to New York was not like the great option. It was like kind of sad news bears there. I just didn't want to do that. So I got a job in San Diego as a prop guy. And I'd never been out here before. And I was like, OK, I want to check this out. Like. And that was really fun, right? Learned all about Mexican food and, you know, and painted like random fake props and stuff. And I met somebody who was like, you're doing the same job that you would in television, but in television you'd probably make more money. You should try LA. So I did. I took the, I guess it was a year and a half in San Diego. I'm a not even moved to LA and it was 2003, four and reality TV was a big hit and it was non -union. And it was just work. And so I just took whatever I could and you know, I did like Flava Flav and I did, I Love New York and those shows. And so you could do a house turnaround and reality TV was fun and the people were cool. And then, I don't know, I just took work and I found the guy who was a set designer who did game shows. And he taught me that game shows and reality shows and these types of shows were a business. And he could balance like three or four at a time if he had an assistant in the office. So I was his assistant and I learned from him and we did cool things like the MTV movie awards and what else did we do? Just like animal planet type different like talk shows and stuff. And then I learned a lot from him and then I branched off by myself. It was just kind of organic actually. What was your first like big job you got solo? I was really proud of the fact that I had like done America's Next Top Model limousines. I was a fan of the show and I was 27 and they had this limousine they would spend, I guess, like $20 ,000 on redoing the interior of. And I was like, I can't believe I'm, I can't believe I'm in my mid -twenties and I'm designing something on TV. Like it was really cool. And then I got, I got some red carpets and some green rooms. And then I got America's Best Dance Crew. I got a chance to design a lot of the performances on that. And that was really cool. And I found my voice, right? Like I was just could finally talk to executives and say, why don't we do this in blue? And they'd be like, okay, cool. Good idea. And I started to feel a little more confident. And so those kinds of little things were sort of the early start. That's cool. And did you find you learned more as you got those bigger jobs too? Like, like, did you take any jobs where you're like, well, don't really know how to do that, but I'm going to learn real quick how to do it. Cause I just said yes to it. God, all the time. It's burning my life. I feel like there are still lots of it. There are still like lots of anxious nightmares I have about like, how the F are we going to do this? I mean, when COVID hit, I was so scared about losing work and I had a team here and we were just moving and shaking and taking jobs. And then COVID hit and I was scared and everybody went home and I was like still at the office. So what am I gonna do? Nobody's gonna want to do cooking shows. What are we gonna do? I'm gonna have to lay everybody off. I was talking to some of the folks in my office about like, well, we're gonna have to slow down. Like, I don't know. And then I realized that we were using this, I watched this YouTube video actually about Mandalorian being produced on a video screen. And they were using Unreal Engine by Epic Games. And this is like kind of fancy promo for producing virtual production and. I was like, well, shit, like, we use Unreal Engine for our drawings. Like, we've been doing it for five or six years. I have like three really skilled 3D artists who do all my renders, right? So it just, the way it works is I do a pencil sketch and maybe a little rough 3D block out. And then I give it to a 3D artist in Unreal Engine and they make it and they light it with me because they work right over there. And we're like, we make these beautiful renders and we fly through and we deliver them to our clients. And I was like, wait, we're working in this engine. I'm going to, I'm going to take a stab at promoting us as a content provider in virtual production. Everybody's watching this sexy video about how Mandalorian was made in this video game engine. So I hired a publicist and I was like, I need you to promote the fact that my little studio is on the forefront of virtual production by making content in it. And because we've been doing. Unreal Engine now for set design pre -viz for five or six years. He's like, okay, but they'll do anything, right, for like whatever their retainer is. So it's like, okay, cool. So I got a bunch of news articles and said we did it and we got a couple of jobs in virtual production. You know, I've never done this before in my life, but it was like survival mode. And you're adapting. You said you're a problem solver, which I think a lot of us in the creative industry, you have to, you have to think on your feet, right? No, it turns out nobody was really doing it. Yeah. And a lot of these businesses that boomed in virtual production have completely collapsed because they've all, they've all fucked up and they don't really know how to manage a process. And we, we still do it. It's still a vertical in our office and I'm, I'm excited about it. but yeah, well that's like, I mean, like I remember like going to bed and we had, you know, game show for Fox, on the horizon, we had a talk show for Kevin Hart, and then we also had this, like random, like game show for TBS, all in virtual, all lined up big contracts. And I remember just thinking like, Holy crap, I have no idea what we're doing. I don't know any of this technical information. I hope we hired the right people. My team is counting on me to make sure that the content they're providing syncs up with the engineer team on site. I guess we'll just back out more there. it was great and it did go well. And. We, you know, it was a couple of nail biter moments on site, but it was pretty good. And with doing like virtual, it must be easy. Well, I mean, besides the person creating it and whatever, it must be easier than actually getting this stuff, painting it, setting up the actual set design. Is it, is it priced the same or it is cheaper when you give them to the, when you get it to the client? Yeah, I think it's cheaper in terms of like overall cost. Like, I think it's probably like, there's probably like a 30 % difference if you do it virtually versus physically. I mean, you know, I don't need to buy 12 plants. I'm just going to put them in my little background and that's easy. So they're just are the nature of it. But I will say like, it's not photo real yet. Like it's close. You can trick the eye. You can soft focus, light it nice. And you know, nobody will really notice, but Some things work and some things don't in virtual production. And so like glass is weird. Like there's a couple of textures that are funky. The software is improving rapidly. Like every six months, there's a beautiful new update. I would say that, you know, two years from now, it'll be like nearly impossible to tell the difference, but it's tough. It's also in different applications. different like multi -camera like it's really hard in virtual. You have different things shooting at the same exact time taking records. that only really works well in a blue screen or green screen environment. That doesn't work well in the LED screen environment. Yeah, that makes sense. It's got weird things about it, you know? Yeah. You're like shooting at a different angle. So there'll always be, I think all these tools, like the AI and all these things that people are using are great, but they're still just tools like. The virtual production is awesome and it's a great tool for you to have, but it's amazing that you have this other like physical structure piece. Cause like you said, all the virtual production companies, they did it and now they're not doing it because like that was the only thing they did. Yeah. I mean, this I thing is a whole thing too. I just saw this news about IA asking the government or the center to team to block it in a contract or something. I don't know. I read the headline this morning and it made me think like, I don't know if I agree, I'm an IA member, I don't know if I agree, I feel like AI is like a helpful tool. It's just gonna allow us to do jobs faster and smarter. I don't know if we have to do things the old fashioned way all the time, I don't know. I think people are just getting nervous because of all the bad things people are saying about AI, but yeah, it's a tool, it's gonna help. It's the same with like computers that like you're like, no one's going to need a computer at their house or a phone in your pocket. And it's like, look, we use it all the time. I think people are just scared to change. Yeah. Which is always the thing. Like any type of change, people are like, we don't want that. And I think you have to embrace it because you use it as a tool. I like it. And yeah, there's some filmmaking stuff that's a little scary because you're like, wow, they just created that by typing something in. Yeah. But it doesn't have experience. Didn't cut to the chase. I mean, like, isn't it just, I don't know. I feel like it's actually super helpful. It cut to a point and it allowed me to kind of, you know, relook at it. If it, well, if AI figure that out, there must be a fresher take on that. There, I can add some spice to that. I didn't just get to that, became totally exhausted and was like, well, my day is done. Like if AI did it, then I can enhance it more. I can revise it more. I feel like it's kind of great. And you can use it with everything. Any job can use it. Anybody, you know what I mean? Like it literally can be used to do anything. It's helpful. Yeah. I'm not a lazy person, so I feel like I will find another use for it and another thing to do, which could then help me, I feel like. And I don't know. When you're at a lack of creativity, like this happens to me all the time, like when you're feeling like there's nothing that you can make happen. Is there something that you look to? Like, is there, do you like read certain books? Do you go for a walk? Is there something that kind of gets you going to like find that process again? for sure. and that's a really good question. And I think everybody's different and I don't think I really kind of knew it until like I'm 44 and probably in the last four years, I really kind of honed in on it, but I take a break basically. And that can be in the form of like going for a walk or a quiet hike or, Getting away from my desk and meeting a friend for lunch, having a drink, love to drink. So like, it's all good. We do too. Take a break from what I'm doing and kind of just have a pause is really nice. exercise. Some of the best ideas come from like a nice little jog. Yeah. Yeah. I've noticed that too. Like I like to do something like that, like walk or go for a run and you start to, when you're not, especially if you're not listening to anything. You start to think and like churn ideas. And it's really interesting how you take that time away from something where it gives your brain like a refresh and you come up with some of your better ideas that way. It really does have to be quiet. Yeah. I think, I mean, just running without headphones is really nice. Also that there's that moment, right? When you go to sleep, it's like, I don't know, sometimes it's like half an hour. Sometimes it's like two or three minutes, but like there's nothing on or. going and so like you get a chance to sort of cycle through a couple of things in your head and sometimes there's like a really great idea there. I always kind of find that there. Yeah, I'll often like if I find an idea when I'm going to sleep, I'll like write something down quick and like notes, but it's one of those things that some people will listen or watch something. I could never do that and fall asleep and I feel like they're missing out on that part where it's like you need that reset before you go to sleep. And if you're like watching a movie, like if you fall asleep watching movie, it's one thing, but if you always watch TV to fall asleep, I feel like you might be missing that space. It took me a while to get there though. I, I, you know, I didn't really, maybe I didn't have very fun things to think about back then, but I definitely now is a little bit more fun to think like, what am I going to do with that set? Like I could do anything. Now is the time to think about it. Like I think about that now. It's fun. Where do you draw most of your inspiration for set design? Is it like certain architecture? Do you find yourself always going back to a certain like period of time? It's very personal. There I said it. I feel like it's now becoming personal. I used, I would be normally have said like it comes from, a connected piece of architecture where I'll scan lots of research, generally Pinterest or Google or a blog or a, an article. that you'd read or something on the forefront, you know, and you're like, I love that. I'm gonna bring that to this piece. And now I feel like what I'm trying to do is, I don't know, be better and try to top the last one and things that are happening in my life just put into the work. And now I'm actually having a little bit more fun with it because you can find a connection point. in anything. Like before I would have to struggle and be like, I'm going to research a bunch and where's that restaurant hotel that makes me feel like the voice and the voice this year. And now I'm like, you know what? I had a baby and I am doing this and the world and the economy is in this sort of state. I'm going to tell this story and I'm making these choices and I find bits and pieces to make those make that, tell that story. And that's kind of cool and exciting. And I think like as somebody who creates things, like an artist and a designer, I mean, I'm a craftsman and an artist. You know, when you do it for a certain amount of time, like there's this kind of like, I don't know, euphoria that you feel with like running, right? You're right. Like you're just kind of like, you're like, I... I'm good, so I know how to do this. So now I can have another layer that I can add into it and you can just kind of play games with yourself. Yeah. When a client, like the process, when a client asks you to like, we want to hire you for this, do they give you some sort of idea of what they want and then you come up, you create it or do you create it, show them and then they approve it or maybe go back to the drawing board? yeah, totally. Everybody has a creative brief. Everybody has the things that they need to address. and how and what they kind of see. And I would say like most people have a vision. You know, most people want, they can kind of see where they want it to go or they definitely know what they don't want. And so in the beginning, I'm a little bit of a detective and you know, you sort of feel like, well, what should this be and what is this? And is there a this like close your, I'll say something, if they can close your eyes, like what? would this space, would this be more like this or more like this? And kind of like ask all these questions. And then I'll just write that down. And then sometimes I'll even ask a couple of fun questions, just sort of get them to where I even think it could go. And I get a yes or no, or that's kind of fun. And sometimes now I'll just do a quick sketch live on the phone. And I won't show them yet because generally it's too soon, but I will be able to just understand what they said. And I'll take a minute because sometimes it's not right. So you have to think about it. And then from there, I do do a design. I definitely will make something semi-finished and I'll send it back to them in a few days and be like, all right, here's what I thought you said. We could go in either direction. And here's a couple of different color versions of what I thought you said too. Cause general, I think a lot of people respond to color as opposed to shape. And so you show them a couple of color options too, because they deserve it. They should see some different variations and then you get feedback. And nothing is better than from a customer standpoint to say if they like it or not. Like they're planning their own wedding, right? They get a chance. It's their vision. I'm translating it. And so it goes through a few revision processes that way. And sometimes the bride is a bridezilla and sometimes the bride is a guy who was just like, I love it. Let's go. So you never know who you're going to get. Yeah. Yeah, is that something that comes up often? Have you had some like horror stories where you're like, this is never going to end? Yes. yes. yes. And we have our like top five. I mean, like, yeah, there are some scary ones. There are some, there, there's anything you want to talk about there. I mean, I paradise hotel, the reboot for Fox was really hardcore. That was hardcore. Our bride was not happy with anything. Even on site. She was just. I don't understand. I just couldn't get it. So much so that I had to fly. We were in Mexico. We had to fly in high -end painters and high -end carpenters to remake and repaint things. And our client was continually unhappy. They were constantly refinishing areas of the set. There was a patio that we built over the pool as an extra seating area for people to hang out in. I don't know how often they were going to go there or whatever. I'm not sure, but like we painted it wood and didn't like color wood. They painted a concrete, didn't like the color concrete, painted a mural, didn't like the mural. So finally I was like, okay, I need to fly in some high end people here. I can't keep up with the don't likes. So, you know, down comes somebody $10,000, whatever, put them up in a hotel, blah, blah, blah. Now they're painting more versions every day, a different version. Wow. And it's gotta be tiring. Well, they're out in the sun, they're on the beach painting, they don't mind it. That's their job, they're painting for eight hours, they go home, they have some tacos, they come back, they're painting something else. Have some tacos. And they find out that nobody likes it every time. But who's paying that bill? Are you telling the client, hey, this is going to cost you an extra 10 grand plus this room and board, whatever? Or is that coming out of the overall pay from your contract? Not my pay for contract. It's a change order, ultimately. And a change order is ... it's very official when you build buildings and it's very, it's definitely detailed, in, weddings and events and things like that. And so when you make a change outside of the scope, you just flag it. And as a designer who's basically contracted to provide the solutions, I don't make the money. I wish I did. They don't, it's Hollywood. I should be there for the love of the job. And so I'm not asking for more money, but they do need to cost that. I do need to provide the costs. to them on what it takes to make the change. And then, you know, I provide a new design, free, and then I get the cost to them and I'm like, hey, to get this done by X date, I need another, you know, thousand dollars for this guy, 15 bucks for the paint, what all that stuff. And then they dig into their own pockets if it's worth it. This is a very special instance. Often this doesn't happen, but... But sometimes it does and I don't know where the money comes from, but they pay it. The bill comes and it's very clearly lined out when you ultimately, you know, you have to, you have to be responsible. Yeah, that's crazy too. Is there anything? So that's like the end of the spectrum. That's like, not so fun. Is there anything that comes to mind? That's like the most rewarding thing you've done where you're like, this was so good. People loved it. I'm so glad that people are happy with this work. They're all, I don't know, it's really hard to sort of say black or white. Like I do look back at Paradise Hotel and I'm extremely proud of the leadership that I was able to give. And you know, and at times I wasn't perfect. I wasn't the perfect leader and I wasn't the perfect guy, but I saw little problems for the team that, and I was there to help navigate a really tough client with another, you know, the network with that tough client and able to help that. And I look back at that and I say that's one of the hardest shows I was a part of, but also, you know, I'm proud of who I became out of that project. So I'm not sure. I do look at some shows, but, you know, holistically, like The Voice, and there were some really hard moments and some really easy moments. And I look back and I'm like, wow, I can't believe I've made 25 seasons of that thing. That's crazy. Jeez, wow. Incredible. So I mean, you know, it's hard. I don't think that there's... Like I've been, I've won an Emmy award three times. Yeah. And, congratulations by the way. Thank you. And I've been nominated 18 times. That's not a good, that's not a good ratio there. I mean, to be nominated 18 times, that's pretty incredible. I haven't been nominated at all. Neither has Dan. You should actually. I don't know. You're already winning in this circle. Not a good ratio, he says. It's not a good ratio. Three to 18 is kind of rough, but. And I'll tell you, the experience of losing is pretty hardcore. There's definitely moments, but I don't know if I've won for the right things. You know, I'll say that. Like there are some amazing projects that we've been nominated for that you're like sitting there and you lose and you're like, damn, that deserved it. But you know, like, I don't know. Every project is different. They're all like a mixed bag of layers. And for me, I don't know. I feel like that often happens though in that like Emmy award -winning space where it's like you watch those award -winning shows and you're like, well, that's definitely going to win or this design is definitely going to win. And it doesn't often. So I wonder, I mean, there's some political things in there probably and some like this wins because of this. And so it's not necessarily just a hundred percent like your design wasn't as good as the next. Can you tell actually if it's good or bad? because only in the Academy votes and each craft votes for itself. Like actors don't vote for design, design doesn't vote for actors. We all vote for the show, but nobody votes for their own craft. And I actually can't like, sure, there's a ton of politics because every craft has its favorite people. And some people are douchebags and they never win. And some people are like just been around forever and they always win. So you can't actually tell if that's good or bad because... If you gave us the public, well, the public would vote for Trump, right? Like, so how do you know what's the good voting base here? Like, you can't really tell. True. The public voting is not necessarily a good option for anything either. Yeah. So I don't know, but it's, yeah, three to 18. There it is. I got a quick question. So my wife got me into reality, some reality TV shows. It's called Thrupple and it's fucking amazing. It's so good, right? It's amazing. Love it. Yeah. But I didn't realize you were talking about on the island and stuff and they rent a house, whatever. I didn't really realize there was set design for those shows, but it's very interesting that almost every, I mean, obviously every TV show, I guess there's some sort of set design for that. But I was wondering if you ever worked on that show, because that show is amazing. I did not work on that show. I certainly would. I will say that a house reality show, is very difficult. The people that work on them, they work really, really hard. Because if you think about each of those shows, and now you're a big fan, is every room, every bedroom is a set. Every camera angle is composed, believe it or not. They look at them for a whole week before, and they make sure that it's not just cleared for take the Starbucks cup out of the way, but like, everything is legally cleared to air on that network and every shot is telling it somewhat story. Sure, we're recording human behavior in it and it's anything goes, but does the color of the room pop? Is this bedspread aesthetically pleasing? Is it nice? Is it youthful? I mean, you don't want it to look like granny's attic in there. You want it to look like a destination that you can go find love in at a certain price point for a certain customer. So like everything is just like, It is curated. There's no doubt about it. They built that bridge over that pool to line up that elimination ceremony. And that elimination ceremony was definitely rehearsed. Not the choices, don't get me wrong. It wasn't like scripted, but they lined up everybody and they make sure that all the backgrounds were great. Because after they record 12 cameras doing that whole ceremony for 90 minutes to two hours, they go to edit with it. And the shots have to be organized. And then... Structured so that you get to tell the story in the edit and they can't look off You can't have one edit shot cut to another and be weird so that's all built out into a little bit of a framework so that it's then put into the edit and then during the edit the people that are airing the show look at the first cut and they're like It's boring. Recut that make it faster. Make it better I got bored during your whole show and they go back and they go back into the footage and they remake it more exciting and so like You have to just make sure that all that flexibility is built upfront when they put everybody into that house. Yeah. Are there other aspects when you're like building stuff for these shows that you would like to do that you don't do? Like, would you like to do the lighting or the camera work? Like, is there some aspect where you're like, I'd love to try this out or I'd love to do some directing. Is there any other aspects of like a set that you'd rather try out. I'd like to do more lighting. I definitely tell, definitely partnered with lighting quite a bit in our process and we certainly light a lot of stuff in our renderings beforehand also. And, and so it's a big part of my job. And I depth, I also give feedback on site to the, to the lighting designer, but you know, like we're all adults and depends on what lighting designer you're working with. You can't be too noodly about it. You can't like be like change to blue now change it's red now. and be that guy. So I find myself wishing I could have more influence than I do there. I also am starting to become a little bit more interested in not directing per se, but like, I don't know, maybe creative producing, maybe like creating a format or story together. So much of my job is to help inspire and build. a show in the way it moves with directorial blocking or how the cameras interface with the people that you've basically done it and given them this package that they're going to just do what you sort of did, but you didn't tell them. You didn't specifically tell them, but you just sort of like, here's your set and they're like, okay. Now I know how to shoot it. You're like, of course you know how to shoot it. I basically just told you now. Yeah, exactly. I feel like I could, I wish I could sort of. take that a little bit further, but then again, I don't know, directors on set, they have a hard job too, and they have a lot of other voices to balance and a lot of other opinions to manage that I'm not sure I wanna do their job either. So I probably would start off with just like, I don't know, show creation, format creation. I'm really interested in that. Yeah, that would be cool. I've always wanted to do like some sort of show type of content too, like. I thought it'd be cool. I had this idea, like if you did a show where you had like different studio sets and then you had creative teams that had to either make a commercial or do a certain shot in a certain amount of time and you had to pick your gear and your lighting. And so like you build your team on site and you get to like do this commercial for whatever it is. So for liquor or whatever, and you like film the product shot, like in your own little studio bay. Like have like a creator show. I think it'd be fun to write something like that. I know, I mean, you're doing it now. Like what you're doing is just like that, right? Like, and you get a chance now to look back at episodes and be like, that worked, that didn't. That's, there's a lot of freedom there. I think I love that. True. Yeah. I think that's, the podcast has been kind of like that where you get to learn other people's process and like kind of pick and choose things that help. my God. Can I ask you like, you're only a few in, but like what's not working right now? Not in this episode, but what's like not working so far? What have you learned, Sean? wow. Put me on the spot. Yeah, come on. What have I learned? I have learned that the podcast world is not as easy as it looks. It's really fun. I enjoy more. I probably enjoy this more than doing anything else in my job, which is weird because I do a lot of filming, directing, but I love connecting to people. And this has been so awesome to like meet new people. Like, I don't think you and I would have ever crossed paths because you're like out West, you're doing a totally different thing in the film world. And so this way, like Dan and I get to meet you and talk to you about your stuff. And it then inspires us to do other things over here where we are. So I think it's a networking thing. And that's what I've learned most about it is like, you can do this anywhere in the world and connect with people around the world and learn from people. Yeah, yeah, absolutely. And in your format of conversation and how you engage with people, I'm sure you take, I guess, if the podcast is not the real world, you take it into the real world and apply those kind of conversations and those things you've learned. But what are you applying back in your podcast world? Like, clearly, like, did you learn like, that question never sort of resonates. I should sort of phrase that dip. Are you learning how to do that? Yeah, I think that's a big thing is like learning what questions hit for certain types of people, re -asking questions that we may have asked other people to see how differently they answer it. And also the biggest thing we're trying to learn now and trying to keep in the podcast is storytelling. So it's like, how do we share our stories with you and your stories with us? And we try and intertwine them. So whoever is listening or watching this is like, getting an experience of storytelling and not just an interview. Like they're like, this is cool. Like they connected on this thing and they both like this. And now it's leading to this other story that they're telling. That's awesome. Actually. It sounds like you got to the root of it a little bit too. Like even as I like feel like I'm getting grilled. No, I mean, I just love it. I love it. No, it's good to know too, because it's like I was just thinking the same thing about Reels. This is it. Like this is the state of the economy, right? Like I'm making more reels and TikToks and like, I'm like, how do you make a good one? What is the fucking key to making a good one of these? And it's literally storytelling. It's everything comes down to that. No matter what it is. I mean, if you look back, like way back in like tribal times, the storytellers were the people that were like most valued. Like, yeah, there were the hunters gatherers, but these people that entertained. Everybody at the end of the day. Those are the people the storytellers Dan don't make fun of me. No Sean always has some philosophical I'm trying philosophical Yeah, I mean the last podcast we did I talked about pottery and then I talked about being in the woods You gotta you gotta connect like real world things. I love it. I think that's true with anything is like reels and I mean we're trying to do that more with the Content we create whether it's for a brand or it's a commercial We're trying to tell a story so that it's not just like, Hey, buy this product because nobody wants that anymore. Nobody wants that anymore. People want to see what other people are doing. Like, this person, whatever is an adventurer. I want to be a part of that ecosystem of adventure. So I buy that product, you know? Yeah, I do. Yeah. I mean, I feel like I'm watching there's a couple of faves that I have on my social media and I always get a little curious when they go behind the curtain or you see a little bit of you know who's the husband what is she talking about like all that like you get involved with their life just a touch yeah and it creates the story and it allows you to sort of like I don't know build that kind of like world with them in your head I think that's what we all want with anything is to hear other people's stories it's the reason why we connect with each other it's not really we're not trying to Necessarily like steal things from people by learning about them. We're trying to learn about what makes them who they are. Yeah Yeah, it's really important. I mean, it's really important to just like not just a podcast but just like Chit chatting with people you can't be so reserved when you're talking with you. You're I mean you have a share your story about your husband like it's okay like You know, I mean like be a little bit more accessible have a conversation. I think that's the biggest thing anybody is missing now, especially the younger generation. It's a lot of like, I mean, I use my phone way more than I should, but they're doing a lot of like social media interaction and when they should be interacting like in person. Cause like I learned way more from like walking outside and talking to somebody who's like at a coffee shop than I do like liking 50 photos on Instagram or something. Right. And judging them and not being woke enough. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And being mad, you're like, I wish I got that trip to New Zealand. Yeah. Like sitting here and like, it's really just about staying connected to people. And that's pretty much what this is for. That's cool. Yeah. You have some great energy too. I love it. Me? No. I was like, thanks dude. Your energy is terrible, Sean, but no, I mean, you're just like, it's your energy since you've come on. It's like, I... I would love to just be around you and be your friend because you have such good energy. Yeah. That's cool. I mean, I don't know. I think I could be tough sometimes too, but that's good to hear. I'm sure. Yeah. I think that's a hard characteristic though. I think you do have that. I feel like I could run into you in a bar and we could just shoot the shit and have a good time. It's hard actually because when I do go over to set, spend more time chatting with people than I do getting work done. Sometimes I will avoid going to the voice, which I mean, it's part of my job. I should go over there and make sure that everything's good and move on to the next one, get the team going. Sometimes you just can't because literally you're just stuck in conversation with your friends for hours. And you're like, wait a second, I've got to make sure that I look at the set before we finish it today. I've been talking with the location manager, the production manager, the production coordinator, the AD, the set decorator. The PA, the new person who just started, you're just constantly talking so much. Sometimes it's a little bit of a handicap, I guess. You never got that thing done you were supposed to. Right, exactly. I mean, that's part of it. Have most of the people on those shows been the same people? Yeah, generally. I mean, on that show in particular, yes. Other shows change staff quite a bit, but it just depends on the show. That show has been great. They're pretty loyal. They have the same crew. They've minimized like everybody has had to over the duration. Not now, but like in the course of its life. But, yeah, of course. Yeah, it's been the same few people. It's awesome. It's like a family. You've seen a lot of people have raised children. Their parents die sadly, you know, and you go through it with them. That's cool though. You have that connection with them. So it's not just like a work thing. One of my best friends ever is somebody who I generally work for on The Voice. And her name's Amanda Zucker. She's an executive producer. We started at the same exact time, the same season. And we've always, in the very beginning, we kind of were partners together. I was making the set. She was balancing the over the entire budget of the show. And we would talk all the time, mostly because my budgets were so high. And I would then be like, we'd be on the phone about it. But you just... develop a small friendship, but from there actually it became a trust. Then it became a deep rooted friendship. And then, you know, you go through issues together and you have a share about it. And then now you look back and you're like, she's been to my son's first birthday and probably got to see each other for Memorial Day this weekend to come over and grill. And you just like, you forget that you, 25 seasons, 12 years later, right? And not every show does this, but you sort of forget that you even worked together. That's kind of nice though, because then it's not just about the work. It's about the relationship. It's nice, but it's very Hollywood in a way, right? Like it's very like television, LA kind of like, you know, who is your real friend anymore? I'm working for them. There's money involved. Like it's like, you don't even know who's who. Who is your real friend? That could be a show in itself. I don't have any friends. They're all here. They're all on payroll. I work for them. Yeah. All my friends are on payroll. Season five. That's awesome. Cool. Well, we appreciate you coming on. This has been awesome. Thank you for taking the time. Of course. Thanks for having me for sure. Yeah, of course. Where can people check out your latest work? My Instagram is fire. It's at JP Connolly. Check out my reels. I just started getting into TikTok. Not so fire yet, but I'm experimenting. JP Connolly one is that and and my website, if you want to go and ask me to design something for you, my whole portfolio is JPConnelly.com. Hold on, I will say, I looked at your Instagram and I've never actually seen another Instagram like that with like the three, it makes an image. And I was like, this is the coolest Instagram I've ever seen. And then Sean goes, have you been to our Instagram? Same shit. I'm like, but I thought it was, I looked on it. I was like, dude, that is, his Instagram is so dope. I couldn't believe it. It's a great way to. It's a great way to do it, for sure. It's my portfolio, but also it's like, you know, I dig Instagram. I feel like it's definitely a little beauty forward. I like stories that are easy to make. But yeah, when people ask me questions too about like, what show? I actually just open up my Instagram because I just log every show when it comes out and I'm like, yeah, we did Penetrum Rules. And because it's just so easily accessible than going to a resume. Yeah. or a website. It's literally like a quicker website. Totally. Totally. Well, thank you again. We'll talk to you soon. Yeah, for sure. Thanks, guys. Appreciate it. Yeah.